Link, courtesy of FSCharts...:
http://www.fscharts.com/index.php?actio ... rport=2025
Let me know how it went. Just curious
,Regards,
Macs
Hardest Instrument approach ever?
Moderators: Guru's, The Ministry
Hardest Instrument approach ever?
Just wondering if anybody had tried La Aurora's (MGGT) ILS DME ARC RWY 01 app? I think it is the equivalnet of KaiTak's IGS approach, but all in instrument, no visual turn to final! :shock: And, yes there are mountains all around, you are basically in a plateau. I am sure many a jet has flown this approach before, like BAC 1-11's, 737's and such (All categories allowed from what I can see from the AP). Below is a link to the AP:
Link, courtesy of FSCharts...:
http://www.fscharts.com/index.php?actio ... rport=2025
Let me know how it went. Just curious ,
Regards,
Macs
Link, courtesy of FSCharts...:
http://www.fscharts.com/index.php?actio ... rport=2025
Let me know how it went. Just curious
,Regards,
Macs
Hi Macs,
I've flown it in flight sim. There's a detailed description of how to fly this approach in Mike Ray's book "Flying the Boeing 700 Series Flight Simulators" His instructions are for a plane with a full FMC though, so not very classic British. :-$ I did it with PMDGs 737. :shock:
He says it's quite possible to get 747s, 777s in there and he's seen C-5s there often.
It would certainly be challenging with something like the BAC 1-11. Must give it a go.
His flight plan started at El Salvador to give a 30 minute flight-
MSLP.YSV.KOSTO.MEGAL.ROSAM.PALEN.AUR.MSLP
Suggested flight level FL200
Why not try it and post some pics in the gallery. Careful how you set the weather or you won't see the runway.
Jon
I've flown it in flight sim. There's a detailed description of how to fly this approach in Mike Ray's book "Flying the Boeing 700 Series Flight Simulators" His instructions are for a plane with a full FMC though, so not very classic British. :-$ I did it with PMDGs 737. :shock:
He says it's quite possible to get 747s, 777s in there and he's seen C-5s there often.
It would certainly be challenging with something like the BAC 1-11. Must give it a go.
His flight plan started at El Salvador to give a 30 minute flight-
MSLP.YSV.KOSTO.MEGAL.ROSAM.PALEN.AUR.MSLP
Suggested flight level FL200
Why not try it and post some pics in the gallery. Careful how you set the weather or you won't see the runway.
Jon
Great!
Jon,
I have in fact been trying to master this approach with Tinmouse (as part of a tutorial I'm doing). I have not taken pics unfortunately, but will do so next time (I guess a screenshot of the track would be better, me thinks).
Anyway, I have been somewhat more successful by performing the approach at around 150 kts and about 500-600 fpm descent from the IAF (Rad 067) and experimenting with different techniques like limiting the turn to final to 20 degrees of bank and stopping at a heading off 335 to intercept the localizer and GS. I am still not consistent though...
Also, I find that the AP is generally no able to cope, so I've founf that it is much better hand flying the turn and final approach. The change of frequency and radial adjust dance is another challenge in itslef too..wheeww! Add to this running checklists single handedly...now I see why you woudl definitely need a co-pilot in real life!
This turn has more than 90 degrees, which is why I think that is what makes it so difficult (like Kai Tak, but all on instrument), not to mention you have only about 4 miles to DH of 200ft. No room for error, timing has to be just right. Now, I magine seasoned pilots who fly this every day, must have tricks to make their life easier, It woudl be interesting to talk to someone who has or still flies in this area.
I have using the Belize Guatemala route BZE.UR630.AUR route, well, actually RAB as 1st waypoint, on a FL280 cruise. Thanks for replying and let me know how it went.
Regards,
Macs
I have in fact been trying to master this approach with Tinmouse (as part of a tutorial I'm doing). I have not taken pics unfortunately, but will do so next time (I guess a screenshot of the track would be better, me thinks).
Anyway, I have been somewhat more successful by performing the approach at around 150 kts and about 500-600 fpm descent from the IAF (Rad 067) and experimenting with different techniques like limiting the turn to final to 20 degrees of bank and stopping at a heading off 335 to intercept the localizer and GS. I am still not consistent though...
Also, I find that the AP is generally no able to cope, so I've founf that it is much better hand flying the turn and final approach. The change of frequency and radial adjust dance is another challenge in itslef too..wheeww! Add to this running checklists single handedly...now I see why you woudl definitely need a co-pilot in real life!
This turn has more than 90 degrees, which is why I think that is what makes it so difficult (like Kai Tak, but all on instrument), not to mention you have only about 4 miles to DH of 200ft. No room for error, timing has to be just right. Now, I magine seasoned pilots who fly this every day, must have tricks to make their life easier, It woudl be interesting to talk to someone who has or still flies in this area.
I have using the Belize Guatemala route BZE.UR630.AUR route, well, actually RAB as 1st waypoint, on a FL280 cruise. Thanks for replying and let me know how it went.
Regards,
Macs
I have just tried it, with a 737. The autopilot cannot help much with an arc.It's not in my view more difficult than any other DME arc procedure ( which are pretty difficult anyway and therefore not generally used in Europe where IMC is common). However, it is unquestionably one of the most dangerous approaches I have ever seen - far worse than Innsbruck in my view. I shall try it with 1-11 and trident next
How do I post a pic in this forum? Thanks,cstorey wrote:I have just tried it, with a 737. The autopilot cannot help much with an arc.It's not in my view more difficult than any other DME arc procedure ( which are pretty difficult anyway and therefore not generally used in Europe where IMC is common). However, it is unquestionably one of the most dangerous approaches I have ever seen - far worse than Innsbruck in my view. I shall try it with 1-11 and trident next
regards,
Macs
One way to do it, is to create an account on any of the on-line "photoalbumsites" (eg. http://www.photobucket.com) or any other
See more here
Then:
1. Take a screenshot
2. Remember to edit the size of your picture to no more than 800x600 preferably in jpg-format. Do that before you upload your picture to the site....
3. Upload you screenshot to your on-line album
4. Use the Img tag when posting:
(Tip: let the mouse hover over the Img-button to get help)
Normally you should only post pictures in the Gallery part of the forum.....
See more here
Then:
1. Take a screenshot
2. Remember to edit the size of your picture to no more than 800x600 preferably in jpg-format. Do that before you upload your picture to the site....
3. Upload you screenshot to your on-line album
4. Use the Img tag when posting:
(Tip: let the mouse hover over the Img-button to get help)
Normally you should only post pictures in the Gallery part of the forum.....
Best Rgds
Dan
Who's General Failure, and why is he reading my harddisk?
Dan
Who's General Failure, and why is he reading my harddisk?
Thanks Dan!DanKH wrote:One way to do it, is to create an account on any of the on-line "photoalbumsites" (eg. http://www.photobucket.com) or any other
See more here
Then:
1. Take a screenshot
2. Remember to edit the size of your picture to no more than 800x600 preferably in jpg-format. Do that before you upload your picture to the site....
3. Upload you screenshot to your on-line album
4. Use the Img tag when posting:
(Tip: let the mouse hover over the Img-button to get help)
Normally you should only post pictures in the Gallery part of the forum.....
Check the link below! Almost got it! (B732 thoguh)...
http://www.cbfsim.org/cbfsimv5/cbfsbb/v ... php?t=7549
regards,
Macs
