Talk about pollution!

Post by **Garry Russell** » 26 Jul 2006, 20:08

Also if the cloud hangs arround at least you can see it and go the other way!

Garry

DispatchDragon · Post by **DispatchDragon** » 26 Jul 2006, 21:43

Garry

I think the reason it hung around was basically due to the humidity at LOS
sort of an instant inversion

Leif

airboatr · Post by **airboatr** » 28 Jul 2006, 15:56

andy wrote:Cor.................! :shock:

Why are American engines so filthy??? :think:

very simple really

it's so after we outrun the compitition
we could say.
Hey we really smoked their arse.
:roll:
wtf over

TobyV · Post by **TobyV** » 28 Jul 2006, 16:13

Some people on here might not like this, but I'd go as far as to say that actually, the first and second generation American gas turbine engines developed in the forties and through the fifties arent up to the standard of British ones. Of course by the sixties, we had been overtaken by excellent products such as the P&W JT8D on the DC-9, 727 and737, the P&W JT9D on the 747 and the GE CF6, which went on to be used on most if not all 2 and three engined widebodies built in the seventies and eighties. The "enforced" acquisitions of the smaller engine companies (Napier, de Havilland etc) by the Big two (RR and BS) killed off some promising engines that could have been used on 'regional' aircraft. RR's 1966 acquisition of BS is regarded by many as having been unnecessary at that point, basically a knee-jerk reaction to a perceived threat by BS to RR's market share.

None of this did any good for progress or for the range of engines that actually made it into production. Of course when RR went bust in 1970, things like hte big RB211-61 (which was a bit ambitious for its time) and the smaller engines being developed with aircraft like Hawker Siddeley's HS144 and similar size RJs in mind.

Since RR was reformed, its been churning out ever better products and gaining market share and making more profit ever since. Sadly for the Americans, P&W's market share has been steadily declining ever since to the point where their only presence in the very large engine market is through the Engine Alliance partnership with GE. GE is still the top seller, partly thanks to its successful CFM partnership with SNECMA of France which has had the entire 737 market to itself since 1984!

Getting back to the smoking, dont forget theres also lots of nasties being thrown out that you cant see NOx's, UBHCs (unburned fuel) to mention a couple.

Charlie Bravo · Post by **Charlie Bravo** » 28 Jul 2006, 16:49

TobyV wrote:and the GE CF6, which went on to be used on most if not all 2 and three engined widebodies built in the seventies and eighties.

You seem to forget the Tristar with it's RB211's..... none of this CF6 tat

blanston12 · Post by **blanston12** » 28 Jul 2006, 18:19

Charlie Bravo wrote:
TobyV wrote:and the GE CF6, which went on to be used on most if not all 2 and three engined widebodies built in the seventies and eighties.
You seem to forget the Tristar with it's RB211's..... none of this CF6 tat

True, the RB211 was used on the tristar, unfortunatly the delays in getting the engine produced gave the bulk of the market to Douglas with the DC-10.

TobyV · Post by **TobyV** » 28 Jul 2006, 20:16

I heard (read) it the other way around - that Lockheed being slow getting the L-1011 off the ground hastened the bankruptcy of Rolls Royce in 1970

The RB211-22B (on the Tristar) apparently wasnt exactly perfect but the later ones are much better and of course the Trents these days are top notch