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Posted: 16 May 2006, 16:22
by Garry Russell
That thought did occur to me as well given that weight as well would play a part.
If the opposite were true then, the American version would have been a fifty seater :roll:
I didn't say that...... a bigger older boy told me to :whistle:
Anyway I could do so research but I am sure Toby will be along with the figures.
Garry
Posted: 16 May 2006, 16:24
by Chris Trott
Pantry = Galley = Food?
That is calculated separately by FlyNET and in the load sheet, thus is not part of the OEW.
Posted: 16 May 2006, 16:57
by petermcleland
DaveB wrote:I'm not sure what detail Peter still has either on paper or locked away in those little grey cells but it appears that the Dry Operating Weight is not a figure set in stone as it comprises the Basic weight, crew weight and pantry!! The figure above is there or there abouts
minus the pantry weight. Gad know's where this is worked in!!
The Trident3B FM I have off G-AWZO (did you ever fly this one Peter??) states that there are two basic pax configurations.. 140 seats (the majority of aircraft are in this configuration) and 146 seats. I wouldn't dare contradict Peter's figure though as I'm sure he knows how many pax he carried!!
ZO's FM
does state a max of no more than 149 although this does not include babes in arms!
The other figures quoted (the ones that appear to be incorrect) all seem to have come from Max Kingsley-Jones book 'Hawker Siddeley Trident'.. Mr Gripper.. and this lists a 'typical' pax loading of 136 for the 3B and a max of 180 :shock:
Well...The grey cells may well be dulling a bit now but did Class come into your numbers?...I'm sure we had some First Class seats when I came onto the Trident, but we certainly didn't when I left.
The 153 seats just sticks in my mind from an engine failure on take-off as we rotated...I just seem to be convinced that I had 153 pax and I know there was absolutely no vacant seat. It sort of stuck in my mind from filling out the paperwork afterwards
...I will see if I can find anything on paper here in the house though.
Posted: 16 May 2006, 17:53
by DaveB
Hi Peter,
Something like that would certainly tend to stick in your head!! :shock:
No.. no mention of class at all in either ZuluOscar's FM or the associatied BA Techinal Manual that accompanies it (ATP 962). There is standard loading for 140-seater.. 146-seater non shuttle and 146-seater on shuttle services. The loadsheet examples given list only total pax although this can be broken down into male/adult female/child and infant. This said.. there
is mention of first/economy codes for use on the loadsheet/LDM :roll: I may be missing something though Peter. Would the defined cabin areas equate to class??... OA, OB and OC (although there was no 3rd class)!!
ATB
DaveB :tab:
Posted: 16 May 2006, 19:13
by Chris Trott
Well, if there was a 2-class option available, per the FlyNET rules, we have to use that, so we'll be using 149 for the seating.
Posted: 16 May 2006, 19:23
by Chris Trott
Aircraft added.
Posted: 16 May 2006, 20:20
by blanston12
A bunch are available for purchase.
Price 20.900.000v$ each.
Posted: 16 May 2006, 20:21
by Chris Trott
Yes there are.
Just FYI, I will add 15 of each as I add them to the database. Don't buy them all. Want people to have a chance to get some.
Posted: 16 May 2006, 20:25
by petermcleland
DaveB wrote:Hi Peter,
Something like that would certainly tend to stick in your head!! :shock:
No.. no mention of class at all in either ZuluOscar's FM or the associatied BA Techinal Manual that accompanies it (ATP 962). There is standard loading for 140-seater.. 146-seater non shuttle and 146-seater on shuttle services. The loadsheet examples given list only total pax although this can be broken down into male/adult female/child and infant. This said.. there
is mention of first/economy codes for use on the loadsheet/LDM :roll: I may be missing something though Peter. Would the defined cabin areas equate to class??... OA, OB and OC (although there was no 3rd class)!!
Dave,
It is possible that my 153 was "Souls on Board" and it was a Shuttle bound for Glasgow so with 146 +3 Flight Crew +4 Cabin Staff, that would be 153 SoB...We had one remaining two class service for a while to Nice but that then went to single class with all the other Trident services so we had NO First Class left on the Tridents for their last few years.
Oh and yes I flew Zulu Oscar many times. I've been up in the loft searching for things Trident but I must have handed it all in or binned it. Found a few pics of Zulu Victor but no manuals or papers...So it is left to Grey Cells and Logbooks now...Got much more from my RAF days with Pilots Notes for:-
Vampire FB5 and FB9
Vampire T11
Meteor 8 and 9
Venom FB1
Venom FB4
Anson 19
Hunter FGA9
and Flip Drill cards for Lightning F1 and F1A
Posted: 16 May 2006, 20:38
by petermcleland
RAF_Quantum wrote:Thanks guys.
Figures duly amended. Peter M, I don't suppose you know if that dry weight is about right? That figure is also in the aircraft.cfg file
John,
That does tax the grey cells but the ZFW rings a bell...I will email a friend who was a Training Captain and see if he has retained any numbers or manuals.
Oh and I think that Econ cruise speed should be M0.86 and I think it may even have come down to M0.84 but I drew the line at 86 because I found that it used the same overall fuel as 84.
ZO's FM does state a max of no more than 149 although this does not include babes in arms!